Also, it can be used with all types of compressors. Existing technology: R134a has been in use in the refrigeration industry for very many years, and theres so much information about the safe use of the product. Have a look in the FAQ Section, and look for "Fan clutches & testing them". Debug the condensor (I am a computer nerd after all!)3. You are indeed 20% out of the OEM spec for cooling. VerticalScope Inc. All Rights Reserved. These two refrigerants are the older types and are not used in newer refrigeration and air conditioning systems. To ensure the right charge, you must fill the new system with between 75 and 85% of the factory-set capacity for optimal cooling. Also the new quick connect fittings for the high & low side. Heres some important advice Whenever you notice your R12 refrigerant is leaking, turn off all flames and open the doors so it can escape to the open atmosphere. Biggest you can fit in there is best. 34 in 70 series w/ R12 in 100+ Tucson, AZ summer heat w/ hd-t, w/ 13B-T is was unbearable about 31 at vent w/ R12. The OEM spec is 2300 rpm @ 12.6v (engine stopped fully charged battery). Hmmmm. As an example, let's say the R12 charge specification is listed at 2 lbs. Yes it will work with either Refrigerant! Mine was 61, so the system is not working as it is supposed to. A/C systems designed to use R-12 will cool best when charged with R-12 refrigerant. Boiling Point: R134a refrigerants boiling point is -26.3C (-15.34F). The pressure at low temperatures is nearly the same between 12 and 134a. Accessories Pumps, Cooling Towers, Evap Condensers, etc, Components Valves, Motors, Condensers, Evaporators, etc, Duct Systems Design, Installation & Practice, Piping Systems Design, Installation & Practice, Control System Design, Installation & Practice, Pro's Forum: National Electrical Code (NEC), Pro's Forum: Calculations & Electrical Theory, Pro's Forum: Electrical Business & Marketing. shown for the parallel flow, aluminum condenser that is listed. It runs between the condenser outlet, receiver/drier unit and expansion valve at the firewall. So you could likely put off buying those new hoses just a bit longer if you wanted. By after changing just about everything, he got what was termed, satisfactory cooling. R134a is NOT less efficient than R12 Actually R134a is more efficient. With tube & fin condensors in MVAC applications there is never "too much" airflow. Inasmuch as R134a has a global warming potential thats over 1000 times more threatening than carbon dioxide, its better than R12. Since then, the industry standard has been R134a, which is an efficient replacement. Please enter a valid email address for yourself. James10952001. and an evaporator core and expansion valve that are optimized for R134a . After the system has been tested out it should be checked for leaks. ~ Mahatma Gandhi, Gandhi, An Autobiography, M. K. Gandhi, page 446. According to Wikipedia, There is such a thing as "r132a" (1,1-Dichloro-2,2-Difluoroethane), however there is no indication of it being a commercially produced refrigerant. They plug all the time. The value of carbon dioxide is 1. The general practice of charging the system with 15% less refrigerant adds to the thermal deficiency of R134a. R12 and R134 are of different chemistry. It can be used applications like walk-in coolers, food and dairy display cases, domestic refrigerators, and beverage dispensers and vending machines. The problem with using an approved alternative refrigerants other than R134a is that when the system is serviced it requires certain types of fittings, labels and dedicated equipment. Until 1995, most cars with air conditioning used R-12 Freon refrigerant which has shown to have an environmental impact. It is a haloalkane and hydrofluorocarbon (HFC) refrigerant that has thermodynamic properties, potential global warming for one hundred years, and insignificant ozone depletion. Can I just use an adapter and save $200? Neuro spine Super Speciality Clinic - Above Apollo Pharmacy, Bangarpet Circle, Kolar - Bangarpet Road, Kolar Town. is good, then I should be looking elsewhere? These efforts to balance the system can not be realized if there are problems within the a/c system, such as: poor performing compressor, dirty condenser or poor air flow through the condenser, malfunctioning expansion valve, water or air in the system, improperly operating fresh air or heat input in the climate-air mixing system. Attach the R134a charge port adaptors, there are two types.. one of which you need to remove the old R12 valve cores. Yep, definately not a meat locker. Quick View. -------------------------"Among the many misdeeds of the British rule in India, history will look upon the act of depriving a whole nation of arms, as the blackest." asia pacific stevie awards 2021. gin, amaretto cocktail. Rxmechanic.com is a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for website owners to earn advertising fees by advertising and linking to Amazon.com. If the water valve is not closing all the way you will have re-heating of the cabin air.The cabin blower was not exactly a powerhouse - it was rated at 200w. Put a relay on the compressor clutch to the aux fan (I like that idea - makes a lot of sense)How does that sound? Besides, its technology has been tested and trusted. R1234yf is more environmentally friendly and has a global warming potential of 4. Paul:A 1983 240D should have a York compressor on an OEM system. Additionally, R134a was introduced as a replacement for R22 and R12 in high and medium-temperature refrigeration systems like domestic and commercial chillers. Jun 19, 2007. It is possible I have 10 ounces (250 ml) in the system. Anyone know what happens when an R12 expansion valve is used in a system charged with R134A? When the temperature is reduced to-7C or below, the plants ability to cool the airdrops significantly. ambulance tailgate conversion However, it was found to be a very bad gas for the environment. Temp switch works the aux fan. Edited: Sat July 14, 2007 at 10:22 PM by fonebone. Right now you know you have a bit too much, but with a CR4P compressor this is an insurance policy. The typical scenario here is when the car owner buys an inexpensive retro-fit kit from the local auto parts store. A thermostatic expansion valve (TXV) (see Figure 1) is a refrigeration and air conditioning throttling device that controls the amount of refrigerant liquid injected into a system's evaporatorbased on the evaporator outlet temperature and pressurecalled the superheat. Measure what you have now.3) Go back to the page in step one, and find the largest condensor you can put in your vehicle. Below are the major differences between R134a and R12: Chemistry The chemical composition of R12 and R134a differ. The most common influences which effect the capability of R134a to perform well are the condenser, in some cases the the superheat setting of the expansion valve or the amount of R134a. What is usually sniffed are all the connections in the system: hoses and compressor, condenser, drier, expansion valve and evaporator fittings. In 1994 they switched from R-12 to R-134a. This leads me to labor over every small decision. I mean, really a lot. Read on for more information about using automotive r134a in a refrigerator and vice versa. I cleaned the evap as best I could, if that is what you are getting at. evarporator, expansion valve plus flushing out the full system and replacing all the o rings. R134a is called tetrafluoroethane (HFC). Large temperature difference between expansion valve inlet and outlet oReplace expansion valve Air . With the oil leaking out and being told all sorts of things about how these compressors don't have a sump etc, I wanted to be on the safe side. . However, take note that R134a refrigerants are manufactured specifically for automotive air conditioners. Hence, the effect of R12 on global warming is up to 10,000 times higher than carbon dioxide. The primary function of the design engineer is to make things difficult for the fabricator and impossible for the serviceman. . This means that it has a high potential of causing depletion to the ozone layer. The ozone depletion potential of a chemical is a factor that shows the level of degradation itll cause to the ozone layer that surrounds and secures the earth from harmful radiation. Though I have seen em run as cold as 12 deg F. If the thermo switch is malfunctioning. With new R12 no longer being manufactured, the market price soared to $100/pound. ~ Mahatma Gandhi, Gandhi, An Autobiography, M. K. Gandhi, page 446. Please enter a password for your user account. I am ordering new parts, and planning to convert my system to R-134a. As noted, measure up front as best as you can to get as close to the aftermarket dim. In a comparison between R12 vs R134a vs R1234yf, R1234yf will pass as the best refrigerant. Above this temperature, the saturation pressure of R134a is higher than that of R12; below, it is lower. However, the supply houses don't indicate a difference. Most of all the differences gravitate to longevity, functionality, and safety. I have some experience with auto a/c but not too much. Why wait for 200f on the engine coolant to start the fan? Theres no doubt that R12 refrigerant is one of the first compounds manufactured for the air conditioning and refrigeration world, but it had to be banned. R134a and water have the same abilities to change the state but R134a can do this more rapidly and at a much lower temperature than water. ~ Mahatma Gandhi, Gandhi, An Autobiography, M. K. Gandhi, page 446. But as there's not a big difference, people say you can suffice with either. This is a great space to write long text about your company and your services. Be sure to test @ 1500 to 2000 engine rpm, and record the ambient temp as well. 2022 nba 2k22 starting a fashion label signing the designer, a difference between r12 and r134a expansion valve, 2020 white paper of the church of pentecost, Chime Mobile Check Deposit Funds Availability, Why Does James Kill Donald In The Vanishing, nba 2k22 starting a fashion label signing the designer. Hence, let us continue to fix it. The car never overheats, if that has any import. Its chemical symbol is CH2FCF3. If you are replacing other system components, such as condensers, driers or hoses, you may need to add more a/c refrigerant oil to the system. And, unfortunately a small high side pressure gauge on a short hose. All pre-97 XJs use systems with the same basic operating principle, although the parts do change a bit. 2001-2023 Griffiths Technical Inc. All Rights Reserved. . However, it was found to be a very bad gas for the environment. Before R12 was replaced with R134a in 1995, it was mostly used in trucks and cars. And yes - expansion valves sometimes need replacing if they are sticky - but a proper AC flush should eliminate the need for a new one if it's already in good condition. In this study, without the need for major modifications to the bus air conditioner, the variation of the ejector dimensions according to different parameters has been investigated in the case of using the R1234yf, R1234ze(E), or R600a refrigerants, which may be a substitute for R134a as a refrigerant due to . I've done the FSM test and with 81F ambient, the vent should be 50F. You may be just fine on oil - it depends on what compressor you have & how much oil you put in.A T/C is short for Thermocouple. _____ 2012 E350 2006 Callaway SC560 . R134a has a smaller molecule than R12 so R134a will leak out sooner than R12. What is needed? The next piece of equipment to track down leaks is a leak sniffer. The oil used in R12 and R134a are different and not compatible. american sniper longest shot; how to adjust sunsetter awning arms; pastor jeremy roberts texas. In addition, R134a refrigerants are not only used in auto air conditioners, they can be used in freezers, aerosol cans, and refrigerators. Most vehicles manufactured before 1993 have the R12 A/C system. In short, NO! Should I do the test again with the the aux fan jumpered? Just had knee surgery yesterday, so I"M not exactly hopping around too well. Rules governing changing from the former to the latter differ between countries. A/C receiver difference between R12 and R134a? = R134a Charge Level. . 5) A/C System Failure. The Wikipedia explanation for expansions valves cited in Frank's thread says that the gas inside the bulb in the metering valve is the same as the refrigerant in the system. difference between r12 and r134a expansion valve. R134a requires a different oil. Get to the point where I can walk without crutches2. The bad thing is I don't know what to do about it. 10,000BTU conduction heating? Formula: (R12 Charge Specification x 0.9) - 0.25 lbs. Since the hose is the stock hose, you cannot tell what refrigerant is inside. Since you will be using less R134a than R12 you do not want to rely on the driers site glass to determine if the system is full. Also, would a genuine R12 TXV be better, or is it too marginal to worry about?I think I should do the FSM test for performance - they have a graph with ambient temp and a/c temp. Replied by Rich928 on topic R12 or R134a. This is the part that controls the system pressures. The P H and T cond,sat of the HR12 at a T oa of 40 C were higher than that of the R134a, resulting in a higher P e than that for the R134a. difference between r12 and r134a expansion valve why is miles raney not on homestead rescue June 21, 2022. manila mayor candidates 2022 If it splashes inside the eye, it could lead to a serious eye problem. It's actually a reaction with chlorine in the mineral oil that may have been absorbed and leftover from the old R-12. Consider using the newer valve, even with 134a stamped on the valve. A Lot of the fins are bent, especially at the top. One of the differences between auto air conditioners that have been redesigned from R12 to R134a is that the condensers have gone from serpentine to pseudo-parallel. Its chemical symbol is CH2FCF3. R134a is the most widely accepted alternative automotive refrigerant used to replace R12. To prevent refrigerant loss you should consider replacing your old hose lines with barrier type hose. gital control scheme. Are r12 and r134 fittings different? I have just bought gauges. Bohica, I appreciate your help with this. The only mechanical differences between an R12 system and an R134a system are that R134a systems typically have larger condensers and more powerful compressors. and feeds it through an expansion valve. As R134A refrigerant has different operating characteristics and pressures this valve is not necesssry. Environmental Impact: When R134a escapes into the atmosphere, it contributes to global warming. I have the original (R12) style expansion valve in the Maverick AC system. Though - the valve for a 1991 says R12 on it, and for a 1994, it says R-134a. They examined the two configurations of capillary tubes i.e. Then when it is switched off for a few minutes and then back on, the air cools again. It is also used in automotive car conditioning and the plastic industry. Recharge the compressor with a/c ester oil and a tracer dye. If there is a resource I should read first to save you time, let me know. This is an electronic tool that sucks in air through a tube and across a sensor. had writing on the side that said R134a. Talk about what services you provide. R404a for freezing of product. R134a was selected as a replacement refrigerant for R12 because R12 contains chlorine and has a major effect to ozone layer depletion. Expansion Valves Catalog E-1, July 2012. 1.5 ounces - hmmm. When I compare parts, 93 uses one part number and 94 has a different part number. J.Harris said: Or if you want to do it like they do in Mexico you can use propane, it's an excellent refrigerant but highly flammable. R 134A is designed for the high demands of an automobile AC and cannot be used on refrigerators due to pressure differences. and he synthesized R-134a in 1936, 5 years after R-12 was . by | Jun 21, 2022 | what is the most accurate latin translator | burlington iowa arrests | Jun 21, 2022 | what is the most accurate latin translator | burlington iowa arrests As illustrated in the chart below, the curves below run together nearly throughout the curve, only slightly breaking paths at around 250 psig/150 degrees and above Flammability/Safety R-1234yf has been designated as MILDLY flammable. At 40, it is 35psi, which is a difference of 8.9psi. Depending on which circuit diagram fits your car (cough, no vin list exists) you have either one or two switches controlling the aux fan. ~ Mahatma Gandhi, Gandhi, An Autobiography, M. K. Gandhi, page 446. And no, you cannot "drain' excess oil out. If you have a York, and it is equipped with service valves, you can check & adjust the oil level without discharging the system. The expansion valve is designed so that the temperature of the refrigerant at the evaporator outlet must have 8 to 12F (4 to 7C) of superheat before more refrigerant is allowed to enter the evaporator. R134a and R12 are among the most popular types of refrigerants. Miscibility with oil: R12 can be mixed with the compressor oil no matter the operating condition. At this point it is time to make an appointment with the a/c shop. Also, R134a cylinders are light-blue in color. R134a refrigerant is lighter than R12. Generally, the new amount is 75-85% of the quantity advised by the manufacturer. I remember I had the wrong seals and it leaked some oil, so I put some more in.Bohica - I tested the pressures. . R12, on the other hand, is called chlorofluorocarbon (CFC). ThanksPaul -------------------------1983 Mercedes 240D on R12 and WVO!1192 Mercedes 300D 2.5 R134a1993 Toyota Pickup converted to R134a. Is that reasonable?Vent airflow is good, I think. Instead, top off R12 with R134a refrigerant. Where would I get some basic info on it, I know nothing about it. R12 is heavier than R134a and has smaller molecules. In the automotive world, the replacement for R12 was R134a. He used thermostatic expansion valve and Capillary tube for analysis with R12. They can be mounted quite easy,and there is a mounting kit that helps to hang it. Is there a difference between a R134a expansion valve and an R12 TXV? Later model cars that come with 134A will have 134A only connectors. R134a is called tetrafluoroethane (HFC). The substitute that we used for R-12 was the new HFC called R-134a. It won't be optimal, though. leading to corrosion of expansion valves, capillary tube plugging, and compressor bearing . A. Pressure/temperature table for R12, R134a, and R513A is shown in Figure 1. . I've got a ball valve I'm going to put in the coolant line before the coolant goes through the firewall to the core. I'm doing one thing at a time so I know what the cause was. When the ambient air temps get above 80F the gauge readings can run a bit higher on the high side and lower on the low side when using R134a. The larger line at the expansion valve is the suction line. I put one in my old daily driver '79 Chevy tank (r-12), and it really made a difference. We chose to use 5-6 ounces of oil to be on the safe side: 3-4 ounces for the compressor, 1 oz of oil for the drier and another ounce of oil for system losses. The difference between R12 and R134a TEV (exp valves) is primarily the 'superheat'. A. Pressure/temperature plot of R134a vs. R12 is shown in figure 1.